| Posted By
George
on 2024-11-23
04:52:30
 |  Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Hi all,
The new Spectrum clone came out recently, which is great, and i was thinking which great original games from the 80's do we share with the Spectrum, that are note-worthy.
For me its: Saboteur!. I remember the game playing it back then.
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Posted By
Andras
on 2024-11-23
04:15:02
| Re: Which are the best games from the 80's that were on the ZX Spectrum and C16/Plus4?
Even before Theamiga came out, I asked the FPGA outlaws if they wanted to make a Plus/4 clone. The answer was nothing. I'm sorry. I would buy an original size FPGA clone.
Best game on the 264 series? When I was a kid, the stuff in the first two game books of the LSI company. Mostly ACE +4
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Posted By
orac81
on 2024-11-23
07:21:32
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Manic miner? With the spectrum 1-voice beep version of Greigs "Hall of the mountain king" rendered on all versions.
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Posted By
Csabo
on 2024-11-23
09:48:31
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
"Best" is subjective, but the topic is interesting to me, because I immediately though of "how would one list these games". We have "external links" to ZX Spectrum versions, so it's doable, but not from the UI unfortunately. Anyway, I wrote a query and... queried the database, there's hundreds. So, instead I shortened the list to: commercially released games before 1990.
That gives us 153 games  Voila:
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Posted By
MMS
on 2024-11-23
11:24:02
 | Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Well, we share a lot of great games with ZX Spectrum, though a lot happened via C64 conversions, like Head over Heels. Laser Squad is on the toplist in my view.
According to my view some ZX Spectrum games were even better than C64, like Thanatos (even the music is better), or even Robocop. The sharp hires picture made them brilliant (though C64 could so the same or even higher resolution, most game went fo the 160x200 colorful resolution)
But I think one of the best game ever made to ZX Sptecrum was Chaos. Only the more complex Lord of Chaos converted to C64 (was a kind of Lasee Squad), a fantastic game, but the original was more fun and faster against a human player.
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Posted By
George
on 2024-11-23
14:46:57
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Hi Csabo
i am happy you got my "hint" ans thank you for your effort, very interesting list!
I think its an interesting query, since i am always interested in comparisons with other systems.
I suggest you expand the side for such queries in a broader sense.
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Posted By
JimmyCoupe
on 2024-11-25
04:55:42
 | Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
We do share a lot of great games with the mighty ZX Spectrum but their version of The Footballer of the Year is much better than our "cough" enhanced version for the plus4 lol.
I am really excited to get my Spectrum, I have asked for it for my Birthday
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Posted By
Csabo
on 2024-11-25
08:08:47
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
TBH that list is quite interesting to look though, there are some many games on it that I personally have never known the Spectrum also had. There's probably a handful where we can argue that the C16 version is better, one such case would be Terra Cognita. What do you guys think?
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Posted By
JimmyCoupe
on 2024-11-25
08:36:51
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
100%, I am sure the C16 kicked the Spectrum bum once or twice . This could be a fun thread.
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Posted By
George
on 2024-11-25
09:46:44
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
@Csabo I always ask myself are there better versions of some of our games on other systems?
I never was into the spectrum so i don't know much about their library but i discovered some really great homebrew gems for it and that got me curious.
Its very often that we got inferior ports for our system.
Some Examples:
Our Scott Adams advetures on the Apple Ii have really cool graphics.
Guzzler for the c16 is the worst version. Almost unplayable compared to the c64 and Amstras version
Saboteur! for the c16 is also very scaled down in graphics..
Always interesting to look at other systems
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Posted By
retroscener
on 2024-11-25
14:10:54
 | Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
I actually feel that Saboteur! C16 was a sincere and valiant attempt at cramming as much of the game into the C16 as possible.
It has a few other missing elements such as the dogs and the trams, and also the helicopter at the end. But the full map and missions are just about there.
If you forget the graphics, lack of sound and those few omissions, there is still a reasonable game in there.
The cracked version is better with its added joystick support. This currently scores 5.2 in the votes which feels slightly fairer in hindsight, whilst the original is currently only 3.5 in the votes.
But will have to go for Plus 4's Saboteur! for the best Spectrum port. As a game I prefer it to Head Over Heels, which is actually ported from the C64 anyway.
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Posted By
JimmyCoupe
on 2024-11-26
08:39:12
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
I have probably given this too much thought and I struggled with C16 games so I can only bring two plus4 titles that truly smash the ZX Spectrum.
Treasure Island - Zx Spectrum has that god awful platform stage on the boat before getting to the island, shockingly bad making a cracking game a shinny turd.
Icicle Works - leagues better on plus4.
Treasure Island and Icicle Works are also better on plus4 than on C64. Off topic Fire Ant on C16 is better than C64. I don't think Fire Ant made it to the ZX Spectrum though.
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Posted By
Fuzzweed
on 2024-11-26
18:41:19
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
I think it is a strange comparison because the architectures are so different.
It's like comparing car racing to motorbike racing. In some ways they seem similar, but when you have to think about it , the differences become more important.
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Posted By
MMS
on 2024-11-27
02:25:08
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
@Fuzzweed
If we see that Jack Tramiel wanted to create a ZX Spectrum competitor machine in the form of 16KB C116 (the original concept of 264 series) you can see that there are -as you told- a lot of similarities. (also: MSX machines forcasted to go to USA, I see it as a kind of upgraded ZX Spectrum)
C116 VS 16 KB ZX Spectrum:
Same PSU, same voltage an polarity, rubber keys, very small form factor. No real music chip, no sprites. Even the two machines speed is comparable due to higher C116 CPU frequencies.
The rest: seems they wanted to make everything better or more than ZX Spectrum had. Joystick port, Floppy controller, proper video&audio output (benefits kept from VIC-20 and C64), much more colors, two times more music channels, higher resolution.
From game perspective the two machines are very similar if we just count the HIRES gfx mode. (well, C116 has character mode, while in ZX Spectrum (AFAIK) everything is in gfx mode.
No sprites, attribute gfx limitation ("color collision"). The ZX Spectrum Z80 CPU was quite competent coping blocks in the memory (needed for SW sprites), but was lacking in RAM speed.
So I think it is a fair fight
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Posted By
Fuzzweed
on 2024-11-27
03:12:20
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
So the similarities are skin deep. They have limited sound and graphics capability.
Actually the spectrum is VERY limited the CBM should win every time in this race
But the Z80 and the 6502 are very different to write for, one is good at one thing, one at another. So maybe if we could find the same game by the same programmer it would certainly be an interesting comparison.
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Posted By
orion70
on 2024-11-27
07:50:33
 | Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Well, interesting comparison - the winner would be the C116 hands down, BUT we really should take into account that the 16/116 had a VERY small amout of RAM at disposal... So, in a mid-Eighties world when this factor counted dramatically, the 48k Speccy was more a C64 than a 16/116 competitor!
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Posted By
MMS
on 2024-11-27
19:57:17
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Yeah, that's right. At the time C116 formed, the 16KB ZX Spectrum was the affordable Spectrum, the 48KB was more pricey, but as for the 16KB only the simpliest games were released, the 48KB became the most frequently buyed ZX version.
ZX Spectrum came out in 1982, and Tramiel left at the end of 1983. So you can imagine, which ZX version was Tramiel's focus.
MSX machines may came with 32KB or 64KB RAM, but 8KB was also there. They turned out to be too expensive to compete with the $200 Spectrum, and not to speak about the planned $99 C116.
"same programmer"
Actually there are some direct conversions. One of them is the classic Sabre Wulf converted in 2013 (and NOT on the list below ) . I remember the hype when it came out, and the very first version was SOOOO fast it was almost unplayable. So the game had to be slew down intentionally for a better gameplay.
I suppose it confirms, that the +4 better fits to such games.
On the other hand, 3D games, like Mercenary, Castle Master runs smoother on ZX Spectrum
One of the biggest mistake of the 264 team (next to the round joystick ports, that are not full compatible with C64 and had no proper protection for the CPU and TED against exteral surge voltages) that the slot MEMORY EXPANSION did not let a simple way a memory expansion to be done.
And +4 RAM could not be expanded further, nothing like C64 REU is possible (AFAIK), just by connecting an external device.
Because there was no easy and cheap way to upgrade the C116 and C16 RAM to 64KB, most of them remained in the original state with 16KB, and it defined the low complexity of the games made for the 264 series. (although they were far beyond the complexity of 16KB Spectrum games)
Most of the ZX Spectrum 16KBs upgraded, some of them just a small extra internal card with 32KB RAM.
Certainly C16 and C116 should came out with 32KB, and Plus/4 could accept more RAM (as "small business computer")
For that RAM expansion handling: that specific not connected pin would have been required called R/S (RAM Select), initially was visible on few drawings, but later on became N/C (Not Connected). With that one the problem explained by the HW experts could have been prevented to run the external and internal RAM at the same time, against each other.
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Posted By
orac81
on 2024-11-28
07:35:54
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
@mms
yes, all good points, but its worth remembering that cbm actually DRILLED OUT the motherboard 2nd ram bank sockets on PET 4008s to prevent people upgrading!
It was a problem with company attitude to users upgrading. (also similar for apple today!)
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Posted By
orion70
on 2024-11-29
03:12:08
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Noooo... I didn't know that... wicked to say the least 
Don't really understand why the did (and do, for Apple) this, given that upgradability would be an absolute plus (well, LITERALLY a Plus in this case  ), making people want to buy the product more than a "closed" one.
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Posted By
Waz
on 2024-11-29
06:46:55
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
Some interesting games which share a format with the Spectrum - but not always the same game, either, even if the same name. Some examples:
Rockman is an enrtirely different game on the Spectrum than the C16 and VIC-20 versions (both of those were Mark Srebalius, a different coding team on the Spectrum.
Formula 1 Simulator on the Spectrum, Amstrad and MSX is a re-release of an old game by Spirit Software. Mr Chip (Shaun Southern in this case) created the C64 and C16 versions to be a different game.
And some examples of where the C16 version is way better than the Spectrum version:
POD - Proof of Destruction Some like the C16 and Pljus/4 version over the C64 version due to the lack of coloured background, but the two player co-op mode on the C64 is awesome. Either way, Shaun Southern did a great job on both and if you own both systens, you shoud own this on each. On the Spectrum though, the 21% review in Crash magazine should be all you need to know - the conversion was badly handled by Icon Design to say the least.
Trailblazer - a stone cold Shaun Southern classic on the C16 and Plus/4, and of course the first release. The C64 version with split screen - yep, all good. The Spectrum version doesn't have the coloured tiles and becomes very confusing to play to work out all the different shaded tiles and what they all mean. It still got a high rating (88% in Crash for example) , but give me the C16 and Plus/4 original any day.
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Posted By
Fuzzweed
on 2024-11-29
13:48:07
| Re: Best games we share with ZX Spectrum
I'll check some of these out. Some great info in this thread.
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