Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-10
08:44:50
|  What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
I am discouraged about my text adventure codes' lack of user base.  I want to ask why this is. What is wrong with them? Can I make them better?
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Posted By
gerliczer
on 2024-11-10
09:21:37
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Most probably no one is interested in yet another text adventure making application. People still into the genre already have their trusty tools and the necessary workflow to work around any occurrent limitations. Nobody knows if there is any problem with it as nobody actually uses it. There is no need for your programme. Can it be made better? Probably yes. Would it have more interest in it? Almost certainly no. The only thing you may try, I think, is releasing a bunch of very interesting adventures with all their sources, highlighting all the advanced features that make your application superior to other similar tools. That may attract some attention to it.
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Posted By
Csabo
on 2024-11-10
09:32:06
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Seconded, the problem is not technical, it's more that no one wants or needs it. At least in our little scene anyway, that should be clear enough from the fact that you've been pushing it for more than 2 years, and there was no response. Hey, don't think your tool is unique in this regard 
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-10
10:12:10
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
I thank both of you for your honesty. Will better text compression help? I'm working on such right now. 
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-10
10:26:53
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Well...these were derived from my Smir 3, 1 text adventure, so maybe if somebody likes that and its interface and wants to use it in his/her own game, he/she might use these. Their major pitfall is horrible text compression, but I'm working on that.
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Posted By
gerliczer
on 2024-11-10
11:26:31
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Csabo wrote: the problem is not technical
Harry Potter wrote: Will better text compression help?
(facepalm)
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-10
13:27:00
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
It can be for other people's text adventures and text adventure creators.
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Posted By
MMS
on 2024-11-13
12:52:04
 | Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65? (update: typo corrections)
My view: nothing wrong with the tool just I am not in the focus group
1) I do not want to learn and use CC65 (in this form). I am a BASIC fan, and also prefer Pascal, but do not like so much the C. As I see the CCS65 binaries are far from ready for Plus/4 (or at least the last time I checked it) and I had no wish to build numerous Libs just to have GRAPHIC, SCNCLR or SOUND commands. (maybe I am wrong, then please correct me). Probably those are availlable at some developers and programmers, but for me seems not ready yet, or at least I am not aware of it.
I really prefer to have the lot of functions BASIC v3.5 offers to us.
2) I do not want to release any text ONLY adventure. I know that human imagination is the best creator of monsters and environments, but I treat myself as (average) graphician, so adventure should have some self made gfx.
My adventure should be at least the level of Gyuruk Ura (like a very simple Steve Jackson corr Fighting Fantasy books) but I would prefer a little more complex, more RPG looking something. You can see below what is in my mind (my work)
Certainly it WON'T be a real RPG, but a very simple adventure (a real RPG with NPC interaction or very complex interaction with the environment or story would be beyond my humble skills), but GFX may show it to be a more serious game as it really is.
Some technical limitations blocked in my progerss:
a) I was waiting for the Plus/4 mouse to be ready for this game, and now we have it thanks to BSZGG
b) I was waiting something faster than 1541, as GFX need speed, Jiffy is not an option, 1551 is too rare and expensive. Maybe TCBM2SD? I will test it.
BTW in case of text only adventure the colored texts and the 80 column mode would be something shine out of the crowd. Unfortunately in BASIC 80 column mode is out of sight, and my skills in assembly are below average.
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-12
19:02:13
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
MMS: I thank you for your response. cc65's Plus4 support is available, as I've been using it to program for the Plus4. Also, if you're worry about inefficient code, I fixed that with CBMSimpleIO, a watered down version of the crt-.s files, some memory extensions and enhancements and a whole lot of optimizations. If you want, I can provide a link to them.
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Posted By
JimmyCoupe
on 2024-11-15
07:52:54
 | Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Can your tool write "The Worm in Paradise"? if so then it would be the best tool ever .
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-15
08:02:16
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
What do you mean by that? Right now, their two main handicaps are that one can't swap rooms from disk and poor text compression. I'm working on better text compression right now but am doing very poorly.
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Posted By
Andras
on 2024-11-15
08:40:08
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
@Harry Potter
Where can I download this program? I would look it.
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-15
08:47:34
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
https://sourceforge.net/projects/cc65extra/files/game/, but you can look at the Plus4World.com tools page for the info. They're under the Programming section. Be warned, though: its text compression is poor and requires manual compression, but in the Vic version, you can disable it, and in the high-end version, you can ignore it.
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Posted By
Andras
on 2024-11-16
04:43:22
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
@Harry Potter
Thanks. I'll have a look.
What is the name of the latest version among the programs?
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Posted By
Harry Potter
on 2024-11-16
06:11:04
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
They're the ones closest to the top, but AdvSkelVic65 needs the errata.
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Posted By
Jason
on 2024-11-17
21:56:51
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Harry Potter: "It can be for other people's text adventures and text adventure creators."
The problem with this viewpoint is that anyone making their own text adventure are either using an adventure writing program where your bits of code aren't going to be usable or if they're writing their own text adventure from the ground up they're going to most likely going to code their own routines and not seek out anyone else's. Essentially, the so called "market" for your text adventure routines and compression stuff isn't there.
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Posted By
Jason
on 2024-11-17
22:01:53
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Me: "writing program where your bits of code aren't going to be usable"
I should clarify that its not impossible to use your code with a text adventure creator program BUT it would take a lot of work to get it integrate and used by said software and someone using such a tool to create a text adventure game isn't going to go through the amount of work that would take.
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Posted By
Csabo
on 2024-11-18
08:41:44
| Re: What's wrong with AdvSkel[Vic]65?
Yeah, we went over this in detail many, many times: the Plus/4 scene is very small, only a handful of folks are developing anything, and if they are, not in C, and if in C, they are not writing adventures. These are simple facts but they fall on deaf ears; OP keeps posting their updates to the point of almost being unwelcome on the forum. I have received complaints about these posts, and it puts me in a very uncomfortable position. I don't want to ban anyone, especially if they are essentially doing the same thing the rest of us are doing (tinkering with retrocomputing). At the end of the day, everyone is welcome to putter along and do their thing
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