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Posted By
Chicken
on 2010-10-27
16:48:31
 |  Re: CBM font
This was mentioned in the Nightfall Crew blog a while ago 
I really like the plus/4 font MUCH better (compare the lower case letters) and already thought about asking STYLE to do one. Since some parts are the same, it shouldn't be too much work.
For CODE snippets this would be nice, too. Though, I'm not sure if it would work with copy and paste (probably requires some kind of filter, at least for some chars).
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Posted By
Litwr
on 2010-11-03
06:12:18
| Re: CBM font
This font doesn't contain all CBM chars and adds some extra (non-CBM) chars. Its Unicode map contains 183 chars. However CBM character generator consists of 153 unique symbols. Some of them are still not mapped to Unicode.  These chars cannot be copied and pasted. See my article.
Is anybody in the world who gives Unicodes to all special chars of retrocomputers (CBM, ATARI, Spectrum, ...)? I think that only 3 bytes unicodes are free for this purpose. Somebody should prepare papers and send them to Unicode consortium. They usually take 3 years to make all things.
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Posted By
MMS
on 2010-11-03
18:02:56
 | Re: CBM font
Well, I read through the article and enjoyed it a lot (I think it is the third time to check it, really a professional piece of job).
I see your point (in fact I never though there are so many repeating characters in C=16), but what will be the AIM to get unicode for ALL?
Those special characters -highlighted by you as no Unicode- mainly used in BASIC programs for frames and as decorating elements.
BASIC is not existing any more -or at least not in that form we use on plussy- and probably the transfer of those beloved BASIC programs would be a real pain to put into the structured programming language, like FreeBASIC, Dark BASIC or Gambas. (they are more like Pascal or Java)
So I think the best way to keep CBM fonts available and enjoyable is to keep EMU writers and the homepage owners motivated. As I told, I am ready any time to support these activities. Cost of some beers/wines to have fun for a lifetime
Emulators know all these codes natively, and run them all without any change. In fact we (or this site) have a huge collection of professional releases and conversions, home-made games, many-many demos, but rather few real-real BASIC gems could be freely reviewed for our own learning (most of the released code are protected). There is a Plus/4 encyclopedia (and to be honest I hardly contributed to this), but with my scanner, OCR and some free time I can upload BASIC programs for general learning.
When my boy become old enough I want to teach him BASIC 3.5, to feel the enjoy of creation. (it is a fantastic feeling to create something brand new without any real material (like mug, paint, pencil, paper), just with your brain and a C=16)
It is a questionmark, if it could be done on a real Plus/4 hardware or an emulator (yeah, 10 years from now onwards...), but the more readible and copy-paste BASIC sample codes (maybe assembly too) we would have the easier to try them and learn it.
(I have a general feeling, that current programming languages are just TOO complex. You have to start with definitions, like INTEGER or REAL. for a 8 years old boy what is INTEGER? how you explain OBJECT?)
Maybe I am wrong, but keeping up the available things seems to be easier than to get in 3 years a code for some special characters, would be anyhow too complex to be used in any other environment, that the BASIC 3.5
Sorry for the looong comment, and being OFF TOPIC (a little)
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Posted By
Litwr
on 2010-11-05
05:01:06
| Re: CBM font
Thanks! I can only note that I meant all PETSCII texts -- this is not only one version of BASIC.
CBM BASIC 3.5 with С16/+4 are very good combination with specific spirit. However seek phrase with word BASIC at
http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655-S00/readings/ewd498.html
I partially agree with it. IMHO Pascal is the best for boys/girls -- it gives discipline to brain. The Python and especially Ruby maybe considered as modern substituation for BASIC itself, but not its C= spirit  .
You can also see bottom of
http://cocom.sourceforge.net/dinopage.html
(about boy's hobby)...
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Posted By
MMS
on 2010-11-05
11:09:34
| Re: CBM font
OFF
Hi, thanks of the feedback some of the languages listed there are real gems.
I agree, that discipline to brain is important, but SOOO many things had to be done before you print "HELLO" on the screen... I was 8 when I started to program in BASIC, I am sure that with C or even with Dino I would give up it 10 minutes. Especially object definition (brooaaaafff , I hate them )
I agree, it is because I grew up on BASIC and assembly, haha. Structured programming is nice, object oriented is worse than spanish inquisition. >;->
I can hardly call object oriented languages simple or easy to understand ("Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability" by prof.dr.Edsger W.Dijkstra).
We have some C and Pascals for Plus/4, I really want to test them. After compilation they should be even faster than programs after Austrospeed. Only problem is the Plus/4 libraries (as I see), for specific fucntions like graphics and sound.
ON
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