| Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-07
08:53:20
|  How can I share my tape?
Hi everyone, I'm from italy, I used to play games with my little Plus/4 20 years ago, when I was just 7...
But let's go to the question. I was really shocked on finding your archive of plus/4 games, just because there i found my childhood, my absolute first games. Between them, I found an italian textual adventure game, Bismark, whom is missing software. I own that tape, with cover and everything, and I tried to convert it in a wave file with the help of a tutorial, but it didn't play.
Could you please explain me what I have to do exactly? I'd like to share this game with you.
Another little question. My plus/4 broke over 15 years ago. I'd really like to play with a real one. I't easy to find it? how much I've got to spend?
Sorry for my bad english, it'a long ago I don't exercise it...
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-07
09:48:55
| Re: How can I share my tape?
If you have a .wav file recorded from the tape, I think it would be enough to just upload it somewhere, and post the link.
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Posted By
Patrick
on 2008-04-07
11:32:33
| Re: How can I share my tape?
chech out ebay, i would say!!
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-07
12:57:17
| Re: How can I share my tape?
The problem is that i didn't obtain a wave file with square borders, but with peaks very faded, and it carries no informations. I don't know if the tape is damaged or if I simply can't do it.
I'd need some technical explanation.
@Patrick, I was just asking for the right price I have to pay for a Plus/4. I've found it from 60 to 100€, isn't it a little expensive?
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-07
13:03:17
| Re: How can I share my tape?
For example, which frequency and resolution I have to use? which codec?
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-07
16:41:14
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Well, it is not a problem if the signal does not quite look as a clean square wave (which is rather unsurprising for a 20 years old tape  ), just try to create a good quality recording of whatever is on the tape, and others can try converting it to .tap and/or .prg. I did some conversion of a few old tapes a while ago, and some of the more problematic files may indeed require manually editing the .wav file in a sound editor to recover the data without errors. As far as the format is concerned, a 48 kHz 16-bit wav file without lossy compression should be OK, but if the file size is too large, then 8-bit (normalized to full amplitude) samples, or higher bitrate compression might be acceptable too.
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-07
17:16:19
| Re: How can I share my tape?
By the way, if you are not sure if the tape is recorded correctly, here is an example file for comparison: http://www.sharemation.com/IstvanV/p4tape1.7z. This contains a 48 kHz 8-bit mono wav file, which seems to load in plus4emu without editing; it was actually reduced as stereo originally, but I removed the left channel to reduce the file size.
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-07
17:26:02
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Correction: I meant to say "recorded as stereo"
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Posted By
Luca
on 2008-04-07
20:34:14
 | Re: How can I share my tape?
Edwardbloom: Bismark della SAD è uno dei nostri titoli mancanti, sarebbe un'aggiuntina mica male! Proprio oggi, sono stato capace di convertire una dozzina di nastri direttamente in formato .TAP grazie ad un cavo X1531 regalatomi da un amico, aggiungendo così alcune rerelease italiane.
In caso di successo, manda pure tutto (gioco e scannerizzazioni) al mio indirizzo di posta elettronica che trovi qui nella mia scheda personale.
In bocca al lupo!
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Edwardbloom: SAD's Bismark is one of our missing titles, it would be a pretty nice addon! Just today, I've been able to convert a dozen tapes directly to .TAP format, thanks to a X1531 cable a friend gave to me, adding in this way some italian rereleases.
In case of success, feel free to send anything related (game and scans) to my email address, you find it here on my own filecard.
Good luck!
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-08
08:23:44
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Ok, I just recorded the tape to a wave file, stereo, 48 hz, 16 bit, and it seems similar to the example file Istvan posted. It's only a little more... blur...
I already tried to use some of the programs I've found here, like Audiotap, Tap Cleaner, but the second especially requires tecnical knowledges I don't have. It indicates that the .tap file I created with Audiotap "has 16+ 0 different values (clean)", instead the file I recorded yesterday had 170 different values, a great progress! , but Yape can't still read it... 
I'm uploading the .wav file to megaupload, so someone who knows how to do, can do it.
I have to wait for the file to be uploaded, i've got a strangely slow connection... when it ends
i'll post it.
I'd be really happy to play again a game I used to play in late '80s...
@Luca, si, mi sono accorto che era uno dei titoli mancanti, anche perchè prima di tutto ho cercato di ricomporre la mia ludoteca di allora, e allora ho cercato subito di convertire la cassetta a questo formato .tap, ma yape non ne vuole sapere di leggere...
Spero che qualcuno sappia ricomporre il gioco originale da quei suoni gracchianti!
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-08
08:39:18
| Re: How can I share my tape?
The last time I checked, loading .wav files as tape images did not work very well in YAPE. I would recommend using plus4emu instead, since it allows any sample rate or format (YAPE is restricted to 44.1 kHz mono 8 bit if I recall correctly), includes some simple signal processing like inverting the tape input - which may be needed for some files - and applying an optional FIR filter. It also allows changing the playback position (rewind/fast forward).
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-08
09:47:44
| Re: How can I share my tape?
I downloaded and installed plus4emu, but my wave file doesn't work... however i'm uploading it, maybe it needs some cleaning.
Compliments for your emu, it's very accurate, even for key mapping, wich lacks in Yape.
A question: how can I invert tape input, and apply the FIR filter?
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-08
09:49:15
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Ok, I've found them, 
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-08
09:52:13
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Wow, now i've got an answer!
I inverted tape input, and applied filter, and the plus/4 tells me:
?BREAK ERROR
what is it?
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-08
10:12:19
| Re: How can I share my tape?
It Works!!!
I applied the filter, and now it works with just the wave file!
I'm very happy!!
Wait until it ends to upload, then i'll scan covers (I do not have a scanner, i'll do it when I can)
See you later!
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Posted By
C16 Chris
on 2008-04-08
15:41:41
 | Re: How can I share my tape?
Why do you create .WAVE files ? I convert my games on PC with Starcommander or Mtab and an XE Cable. You can fond a lot of them for download hiere: http://www.c16chris.danbike.de/z%20Komplett/Spiele%20ABC/Spiele%20ABC%20-%20Total.htm
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Posted By
Gaia
on 2008-04-08
16:58:32
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Edward: you do not really need a manual key mapping feature in Yape because it has full symbolic keymapping that you can find under Settings -> Input setup -> Windows input method -> Message Queue symbolic keymap. It even maps shifted symbols correctly so you get back exactly the same characters that you see on the keyboard (when it is applicable).
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Posted By
Edwarbloom
on 2008-04-09
08:29:36
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Here we are! here is the link for Bismark game:
http://rapidshare.com/files/106089839/Bismark__Wav_stereo_48_hz_16-bit_.wav.html
(I'm not allowed to use html?) It's a 47 MB wave file, I didn't reduce it because I don't wanted to damage it! maybe someone could do it better than me. I'll make scans when i can, i've got no scanner. Bye!
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Posted By
Edwarbloom
on 2008-04-09
08:56:30
| Re: How can I share my tape?
I just made a photo of the cover, here is the link:
http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/7749/bismarkcoverdn7.jpg
I'll scan it in any case, but I'm glad to share it.
I hope you'll add the game to your list, bye, ed.
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-09
09:05:26
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Thanks for posting the .wav file. I have managed to successfully load it without errors, and created a .prg file: http://www.sharemation.com/IstvanV/Bismark.prg. A .tap file could also be made, although the original tape is apparently just a basic program saved with the kernal routines, and there is no tape turbo, loading screen, or other special feature.
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-09
11:06:23
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Di niente! Hai capito al volo i miei gusti, eh? l'ho già giocato, e devo dire che mi è piaciuto molto anche Conan... queste avventure testuali nel 2008 hanno ancora un fascino indescrivibile!
Avrei una domanda da fare: ho scaricato il file .prg di bismark, l'ho caricato sull'emulatore, e poi ho dato il comando LIST, e mi si è snocciolato davanti tutto il programma: ma non si può tornare indietro, è visualizzabile alla fine solo la parte visibile nello schermo; come posso fare per avere tutta l'estensione del programma ad esempio in un file di testo?
You understood my taste! I already played it, i liked Conan too. Textual adventures even in 2008 have an incredible charm!
Can I ask you a question?: I downloaded bismark's .prg file, loaded it in the emulator, gave the LIST command, and I obtained all program in screen: but when I try to go up at the beginning of the program, I can't view it, because I can visualize only the visible part of the screen. How can I obtain all program, for example in a text file?
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Posted By
Luca
on 2008-04-09
11:38:08
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Eh no, lo scorrimento testuale di questi computer non ha memoria
Puoi solo premere RUN/STOP in tempo, oppure bloccare lo scorrimento con Control+S, oppure listare la sezione interessata, per esempio LIST 10-300 (da riga 10 a riga 300), oppure LIST 20- (da riga 20 fino alla fine).
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Heh no, these computers'text scrolling has no back memory ;)
You only can press RUN/STOP in time, or stop the scrolling with Control+S, or list the slice you're interested to, e.g. LIST 10-300 (from line 10 to line 300), or LIST 20- (from line 20 to till the end).
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Posted By
IstvanV
on 2008-04-09
11:56:29
| Re: How can I share my tape?
You can also print it using printer emulation.
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Posted By
Edwardbloom
on 2008-04-09
12:13:13
| Re: How can I share my tape?
Thanks, I paused on and on, and copied...
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